Is It Time for Digital Hygiene?!

Joana P. R. Neves: ⁓ that Art Etiquette is going to be a very short segment, 10 minutes only, ⁓ but I keep the whole conversation Responding with joy is the path and we should work and eat with joy. The joy counts and nothing else does. There is in reality no need for self sacrifice and no call for it. Do not settle for the experience of others. If you follow others, you're in reality at a standstill, because their experience is in the past. That is circling. Even following your own past experience is circling. I wandered lonely as a cloud that floats on high Over vales and hills, when all at once I saw a crowd, a host of golden daffodils, Beside the lake, beneath the trees, fluttering and dancing in the breeze. Continuous as the stars that shine and twinkle on the Milky Way, they stretched in never-ending line along the margin of a bay. Ten thousand saw I at a glance. we in a world that considers everything to be potentially quantifiable. So fandom, for example, is based on ⁓ how people an actor who has a big, big, big fan base, ⁓ can to cinemas. accessible ⁓ ⁓ a bonus. for oft when on my couch I in vacant or pensive mood Know your own response to your own work and to the work of others. To recall in one's own mind past concrete experience is not circling. It is so much easier to respond accurately when alone. Experiences recalled are generally more satisfying and enlightening than the original experience. It is in fact the only way to know one's whole response. And later. Tossing their heads in sprightly dance. The waves beside them danced, but they outdid the sparkling waves in glee. A poet cannot but be gay in such a jocund company. They flash upon that inward eye which is the bliss of solitude, and then my heart with pleasure fills and dances with the daffodils. many goodies out there that don't make it to ⁓ the episodes. And why not ⁓ allow you to ⁓ podcasts ⁓ with something extra your own pleasure? going to try and set up the I gazed and gazed, but little thought what wealth the show to me had brought, The straightforward path, as we so often have been warned, is extremely hard to maintain. Only joyful discoveries count. If you're not making them, you are not moving. Now let us turn to abstract response. The response that we make in our minds free from concrete environment. We know that it prevails. We know that it is infinite, dimensionless, without form and void. But it is not nothing because when we give our minds to it, we are blissfully aware. ⁓ Culture seems for the most part be out of that. We don't deal with great quantities, we don't worldwide viral. ⁓ And I wrote article ⁓ stating ⁓ that ⁓ Being without imperfection, it is perfection, and being without parts, it is whole. A while ago, but also noticing how some artists can go viral. And that weirdly proved my point. It is from our awareness of transcendent reality and our response to concrete reality that our minds command us on our way, not really on a path or to a gate, but to full response. Complete consciousness is present to us at all times, every moment, but we reject it in order to maintain our prejudices, our ideas, but sooner or later we will relinquish our ideas in favour of response, because a truth prevails. I got a message saying that I was a parasite of society and deserved to die ⁓ because I curate ⁓ contemporary art performances. And I reached out to these artists, and that's when I knew ⁓ what was going on. In the meantime, we can see ourselves in our own work. We can see ourselves moving along, we can see the steps we take, we can see that there is no such thing as going backward, we can be contented. We can know every day that we must do what we must do, and we will have plenty of Snoop Dogg put in one of his stories ⁓ one of those performances. in a sense, ⁓ whether these are going viral on Instagram or not, ⁓ it doesn't touch ⁓ our own field energy with which to do it. We will know when it is something we want, and we will know when it is something that we do not want. Anyway, to my earlier point, ⁓ despite this little anecdote, ⁓ I do think it is to think about the including AI as having everything in Perhaps that might be one of the reasons why it's not getting to you. still, There's a lot on digital platforms anyway. And so, in theory, ⁓ culture should us, right? ⁓ when we talk about digital media, we're talking about screens. They have become the maligned element that is destroying humanity through virtual platforms, spaces, and you know, ultimately lives. I see people in transports, outside ⁓ Leonardo Vinci off. This was live, reading the news listening to a podcast. chatting via video WhatsApp on group chats, watching comedy clips. I mean, nothing really horrifying, really. But what are screens? ⁓ So, a screen ⁓ used to be ⁓ a piece furniture protected us the fire, that ⁓ term came the Middle Dutch, schem, schem, ⁓ meant to cover, to shield. So A screen would somehow symbolically or physically protect. It still ⁓ Meant the same thing when it started denoting the divider, so this piece of furniture that conceals a space. ⁓ In 1810, it became a flat surface to receive projected images. This in reference to lantern shows. So, you know, a play of and shadow. And then finally, in 1946, it was ⁓ Extended to the TV set and later on to the computer monitor. So tech turned the screen into a receiver and a diffuser of information, much like a canvas before it, if you think about it. Proto-Indo-European origin of the word means to cut. And that made me of a text by Hollis Frampton ⁓ that makes a sort of a parallel between photography and the butcher. of course, here we're talking about computers, probably moving image, but anyway, photography is a recording technique. It's the first recording technique that led to the creation of cinema. And so the butcher using a knife cuts ⁓ so reduces a raw carcass, he says, edible meat. He does not make ⁓ the meat, he the cuts, so dimensionless as he calls them, quote, the photographic act is complex cut in space and time, dimensionless in itself as the intersections and figures in Euclid's elements, ⁓ and ⁓ in the mind, ⁓ ⁓ real, so as as geometry being is sort of an language to ⁓ cut and organize reality. But also to build stuff from that language. That's the conundrum, right? at the end he says, the visitor, so the this person who takes the photograph, thereby makes his own cliches that were at one time vistas newly decreed ⁓ imaginary lines ⁓ laid out in space. by the first photographers who saw them, acts of making ⁓ more durable than and to geomancy than bricklaying. This means that ⁓ not the photography is durable, not the object in itself, but that landmark. Hello and welcome to Exhibitionistas – Notes on ⁓ I'm your host Joana P. R. Neves and this is your Art wonderment podcast. And therefore media carries the the culture. in fortnight, we will go back to the program. ⁓ And so this is the last one ⁓ of my special episodes. But unlike the butcher that actually cuts the carcass and turns it into something edible and digestible ⁓ therefore disappears, each time we consume The image. unlike these cuts, the butcher's meat, this information that on screens creates an dynamic ⁓ network of realities. ⁓ I am to explain what is first and foremost. ⁓ Then I'm going introduce two new segments called Art Etiquette and Brainstorm in a Teacup. ⁓ More on that I'm also going to ⁓ answer a question I'm going to ask right now, screens nowadays, they're a piece of furniture ⁓ is digital cutting us off? from culture. They bear the memory of those lantern of this play of and light, It is said ⁓ Pliny the Elder's Finally, I'm going to tell you how you can benefit from Exhibitionistas' live events, workshops and art space in London, if you're in London, but those events over there, some of them will have online versions that you can participate in. fragments ⁓ of big natural history book, that it is well known that the origin ⁓ of drawing, of painting, ⁓ a woman drawing the shadow, the projected shadow ⁓ of her departing lover onto a wall. ⁓ we consider that these screens are this kind of furniture that bears that memory. There is something also a bit sexy about them. So they reveal as much as they conceal, because the interesting idea of the origin of art being an outline of a shadow of someone real is that it is a trace of something that really happened. So there's ⁓ a recording device in some way. So art as a recording device. And at the end of this text, Hollis Frampton. says through such acts, endlessly renewed, so taking photos, we have learned to recognize all the appearances of the world. Through such acts, from its very beginnings, photography reasserts art's most ancient and permanent function, the didactic. not only recording, ⁓ but through this recording, transmission, But there's also something is if it's piece of It means that at least in theory, it is accessible, it is for everyone, it is democratic. So everyone through screens can have access to the same art piece. If anything, media creates culture. I use the word wonderment. So this is the first thing I wanted to talk about today. The notion of wonderment. you know, those animal, ⁓ bird and ⁓ game whistles ⁓ that you blow into. Some of them produce big noises. Others like a really subliminal noise that you can't really hear, but the animals will hear It's kind of like that for my fellow friends, my sisters, my brothers, my non-binary siblings who love words as much as I do. screens ⁓ in terms of technology, in terms of this democratic use of them, have somewhat upset the hierarchy of. The author and the creator, then the medium, the technology that diffuses or that bears the work, and the spectator slash professional critic. But still, we maintain the same structure, which is the artist makes, the critic reviews, it's also because ⁓ that word, wonderment. It is fair to say produces a sort of a double take. It is not wandering. So it's spelled ⁓ so wonderment. and the critic ⁓ ultimately will look at the work through the binary of good or bad. you don't quite know what it is. You presume it's close to And it's not. So the Cambridge Dictionary defines ⁓ wonderment as, ⁓ quote, "A feeling of great surprise and admiration caused by seeing or experiencing something that is strange and new". Isn't that precisely what happens you experience art? When you go and see an exhibition, for example, you know, if all goes well, obviously. there is always an element of discovery. and listen, I love words and I ⁓ ⁓ the flexibility of etymology because sometimes meanings travel, but it doesn't that they will travel in a mathematical exponential They be traced. ⁓ a sort of linear It is really interesting to see that language kind of replicates displacements and our contradictions well. so ⁓ wonder, wonder and wander, there's a real overlap. The meaning of these two words plays off each other. So wandering means to roam about without a specific aim. And wonder is to be open to a surprise, is to be in admiration, even perhaps in awe and even to marvel at something. And of course, when we think about wandering, we think about this openness of spirit to discovery. and to even brave difficulty to get to a place that might be worth it despite the hurdles get there. ⁓ So there's a real overlap. And I learned while researching these two words ⁓ that there's a linguistic phenomenon, which is ⁓ similar words in language either through sound spelling or both, start sharing their meanings through confusion. And I love this phenomenon because as much as we try to explain something, and this is something I, as a curator, ⁓ usually tell artists who seek feedback, who seek some sort of advice regarding the way they present themselves and regarding the way they introduce their work. And I always say this, don't explain the work, the pleasure, ⁓ of ⁓ conversing and doing something that the Mexicans say platicar. So the word practice ⁓ can as praticar with an R, but you can also say platicar, P-L, and platicar is the art of conversation without particular goal in sight. it's a sort expertise, that ⁓ relies mostly intuition guts ⁓ and reactivity and listening to what the others saying ⁓ you may be misunderstood. ⁓ Someone else may be going a different journey throughout act of platicar. But they're getting somewhere and it doesn't matter if they're wrong, if they're right, if they misunderstood something. The goal, when there is no goal, is to carve your own path ⁓ into that experience ⁓ and to somehow find yourself in it. take this little voyage into sort of a visceral relationship with words as an ⁓ of the wonderment that you find in your Art Wonderment podcast. the granular experience of things, because that's you can do in these ⁓ digital platforms. You don't explain, you don't... ⁓ substitute experience ⁓ actually being in the presence of an artwork. the next episode is going to be precisely about that through the reading of Walter Benjamin's seminal book ⁓ titled The Work of Art in the Age ⁓ of Mechanical Reproduction. I hate title. always hesitate I say it, but it's written on my notes. ⁓ what do you on screens? I asked myself that I nailed it. I'm happy. Anyway, moving on. so another thing that I've experienced while fine in the background, episodes is something that ⁓ I ⁓ was completely nuts that no one would enjoy. That I was the only one who found important, is out loud. at a certain point, the iPhone would send you how long you'd stayed on ⁓ you'd use the screen. the length of time, so the quant again, this idea of quantifiable things of the quantity time doesn't measure impact. can the love of your life for a quick lunch, ⁓ and the impact won't be the same as the time you spend with your. There's a sort of magic ⁓ in there. one of the things that I thought about ⁓ reading Agnes Martin's ⁓ diaries, ⁓ texts, writings ⁓ a long, long time ago. Hated colleagues in the office space that you share with them, even though you spend ⁓ the best of five, six, seven, eight with them a day or a week, And discovering through her, so she was a painter ⁓ who in the century, second half of 20th century, a very big, big reference for particularly minimalist and even conceptual artists of the 60s and 70s ⁓ who moved to New Mexico. life is incredible and I'm sure we'll dedicate a whole episode one day to her. So ⁓ that ⁓ relationship between impact, ⁓ value, ⁓ and time ⁓ is not we think it is, basically. ⁓ I discovered ⁓ because I didn't grow up here in the UK. So there's a lot of things that I don't know that are incredibly familiar, obviously, to the Brits, even perhaps even to Anglophones across the globe. But I didn't know that poem, which is quite a famous one, a Wordsworth poem. And in Wordsworth, the word word, of course, or words, ⁓ plural. The poem, I wandered lonely as a cloud. But first, I'm going to tell you why. So maybe best thing I thought to look at how I was screens. ⁓ So ⁓ basically I write, ⁓ I record, and I edit ⁓ on ⁓ screens, but because a writer and show creator. ⁓ But ⁓ of things that I noticed ⁓ when I was sort of measuring time I spend. Agnes Martin loved it so much. It has to do with wonderment, obviously. Editing, recording, scripting, writing my texts on my computer. I noticed that if I am invited to do a conference or to participate in a panel discussion, I will not be introduced as a podcaster. I will be introduced as an art critic and a curator. because that activity isn't contemplated as a valid ⁓ professional role But then I started to think: at Hessel. So Katy Hessel in the UK, but also worldwide, is pretty established. She's always in the charts of the most listened to art podcasts or book podcasts. So she started with an Instagram account, moved on to a podcast which is called Great Women Artists Podcast, and it taps into ⁓ a easy consumable thing, which is the feminist trend. she doesn't stray that much what gets the program into the culture. being interviewed is really you can find the most ⁓ in any digital media out there when you're looking for contemporary art So she goes on to say that for her, the importance ⁓ of the experience is and the joy found in experience is to recall. quote, to recall one's mind past concrete experience is not It is so much easier to respond accurately when alone. Experiences recalled are generally more satisfying and enlightening. So as as a visual artist enters the public sphere and the public space, the reaction ⁓ than the original experience. It is in fact the only way to know one's whole response. To illustrate recall, I will quote Wordsworth on having seen daffodils. And this is the poem that a lot of you will know, but I just want to read it because it's such a joyful poem Was to say whether it was good or not, because that's the language that we projected out there Many art critics have been fired ⁓ from many important newspapers. in the US, for example, in the UK. I will be very candid here. I I don't read a lot of reviews. if I've seen an exhibition, I to read what ⁓ an interesting ⁓ scholar, academic, writer, independent, ⁓ podcaster has to ⁓ about the exhibition ⁓ in terms of whatever researched about the or the topic, ⁓ whatever they felt when they went there. I'm not really interested in knowing whether it's deserving art. ⁓ Or not. There have been so many mistakes in art history. I think that should humble us and establish parameters ⁓ of ⁓ evaluation of our own relationship to things ⁓ Agnes Martin says, and ⁓ what it is that ⁓ creates an artistic object that is worth calling it such, And questioning the way it holds ⁓ and whatever relationship it creates with you is ⁓ what personally excites me. So Katy Hessel is now a personality culture and visual arts culture in the UK. She is invited for cultural events everywhere. If you go onto her website, ⁓ was just at the Hay Festival interviewed by David who's a an important established historian, ⁓ about her book, which the less said it, the better. one is tempted to say that the real experience of daffodils ⁓ is the one, How did she obtain that? She published books that present a sort of archival list ⁓ of overlooked artists But it's not critical thinking. she picked a clickbaity topic, she published books, ⁓ she now is well connected and is invited in prestigious ⁓ institutions, ⁓ But I prefer to think they are complimentary and are a sort of a It's through repetition, rereading or that things get really embodied in us ⁓ is by revisiting them. This also says a lot about the publishing industry. This means that the publishing industry is also subjected to digital media. But what I like about ⁓ Agnes Martin's text is that ⁓ it doesn't the artistic experience. It talks joy and the powers of joy, ⁓ much more than happiness. If you look, for example, at another author, female author, such as Lauren Elkin, for example, whose book Art Monsters is very often in museum shops, that's a whole different story. But experiencing joy something much more profound. It's an almost sacred kind feeling, emotion. It takes hold of the whole body and carries you and it lifts you up. The experience of joy is something that happens across time. And you visit her website, it's really interesting how she presents herself. Rather than listing all her appearances, she just released a book about female voice, the use of female voice. Vocal Break, it is called. ⁓ And ⁓ she credits all the who have interviewed her, ⁓ written about ⁓ ⁓ lifts everyone up with her. She's creating a community this is really important. I want to talk about the fact that the experience, so the openness, the encounter with the artwork in the presence of the artwork is varied and it can also happen through an image. if you get to her book, you buy her book in the museum shop, then maybe if you look, if you Google her name in the podcasting platform, then maybe you'll get to an interview of her or any podcast that mention her books. And maybe that way you can find new people and you can find different sorts of profiles of podcasters and podcasts through hearsay, someone talking about their experience is that something that you can't consider to be an aesthetic experience? To where and to what can be reduced the aesthetic experience, the creative encounter? but it is difficult. I won't say that it's not difficult. That's not my point here. I'm even going to say that we are confusing ⁓ as a society connection with savvy PR and quality with savvy PR, ⁓ lists and infos, know, plucked from academic archives with critical thought. there is something called ekphrasis and to be very honest with you, that's what I wanted to call the podcast, but then no one, absolutely no one would listen to it. I don't know, I have a thing for unpronounceable words probably because EXHIBITIONISTAS is a tongue twister. Culture is not a list of things. It's not listing ⁓ interesting ⁓ and thought-provoking creatives. ⁓ It's more than It is a of investigation that will withstand the tests of time and that will shift perspectives. is a Greek and it ⁓ denotes, ⁓ designates ⁓ a artwork that fictional that exists in the culture. So this was first applied to ancient poetry and then it extended to any form of fictional writing. Think about ⁓ the famous portrait ⁓ in ⁓ the Wilde book. picture of Dorian Gray. You've never seen that portrait and yet every one of us has imagined or at least the idea of that portrait. So to what extent are aesthetic bound to being in the presence ⁓ of artwork itself or having a direct connection to the artwork? And so "takes" are okay. I'm not against that. I also watch them on Instagram, that American he's always having takes on everything. I find I find him, you know, amusing. We will talk about that the next episode with the help of theorist Walter Benjamin, who you probably know, and his very famous ⁓ Fine, great. And so now moving on to the second thing I wanted to introduce, the second idea that I wanted to introduce to you, which is the structure of the episodes. But programs that explore, you know, Topics that are both classic or current, but that bring in like existential, interesting, important, joyful, and fun, also playful ways of engaging with the world are necessary to circulate culture. They're necessary to build it up and to make it meaningful and to make it something that stays with us. You know, thinking of Agnes Martin's So consider these episodes like a garden. When you arrive, you need to see a sort of a solid path that you can follow calmly and just give in to the beauties of the landscape reflections earlier on. So you need a sort of a fence that opens up. That is going to be the question. So I will start every episode with a question, which is probably very often going to be the title of the episode. But once you do find them, what do you do? So I was watching a really interesting ⁓ interview those will come from my work ⁓ as curator and as someone who is directing and programming a space, a nonprofit in London called Worlding So over there, I will start ⁓ doing some workshops ⁓ will also happen If you want to join, I will talk about them they were talking about social media. It was interesting to see the different that those actresses had with social media. So some of them were talking about memes, ⁓ they're memed, ⁓ what meme of theirs they prefer, etc. ⁓ another one was saying that she the manager and she created Diane Keaton's ⁓ Instagram account, and that was fascinating. And she said she was blissful, she was always happy because she didn't read the comments. So total disengagement ⁓ and a media basically just strategic operation here. it also provides a possibility of experiencing Worlding in other forms, particularly through the podcast. if you're in London, also conversely, you have the possibility of extending your Exhibitionistas experience either through my writings on Substack or by going to our events, activities, door events, concerts, workshops, talks, performances, et cetera. And Keke Palmer says something interesting. She said, Well, social media has horrible aspects for sure. People say the most horrible things, but in hindsight, And she's a podcaster as So that's for the question. She's a very lively and original thinker. And proving that, she said, ⁓ I ⁓ find it really useful because the people who really love what I do, who appreciate me as an they me, they know where I am, I engage with them, I see them in events, ⁓ and I know that they have my back and I have theirs. We are in constant engagement with each other. And it's a really nice tool to find your community. we are arriving to the second segment that I to introduce, which is art etiquette. I have an called art etiquette. It's not quite the same thing. Apologies for. ⁓ the confusion, but I do love this title. And I don't know if you have followed the podcast since the beginning or if you're new here, but the first season was a very simple format. My friend Emily and I would visit an exhibition and then we'd discuss it from the prism of someone who is not at all in the art, the contemporary art industry and from my own prism, which is sort of the prism of the specialist, of the expert. And we had really interesting conversations. And I miss the ability of bringing other perspectives and other voices into the podcast. Voices of people who are not particularly in the art field or who are in the contemporary art field, but from a completely different kind of work and therefore a completely different angle. So what I thought was: ⁓ if visual culture, visual ⁓ literature, ⁓ critical thinking, music, making, experimental art is really important to me, and the philosophical debates ⁓ around them and the and also the togetherness that they bring about. ⁓ Then I can't pretend that I'm not on those screens and that I'm not using them. I was using YouTube like a noodle. I was, you know, watching a few interviews of some actors about some I'd just watched, and of course, always looking for mainstream stuff because I thought nothing else was there. But you have the whole Courtauld conferences and seminars in there. really love it to be a of a Socratic ⁓ where I'm not here lecturing anyone, but I also needed to produce it. But that was that was me. I love know where the question comes from, why that question particularly, then explore own relationship with contemporary art or lack thereof. that's it art etiquette. ⁓ ⁓ And we are going to move on to what I want to call digital hygiene. And I it on my notes and I almost said dental hygiene. No, no, no. digital hygiene. responding specifically to the question, is the digital ⁓ media environment that we live in cutting us off from culture? Maybe culture is shaping itself ⁓ in a different way elsewhere. So one of the things that ⁓ I can do extend your Exhibitionistas experience. So this is the last thing that want to talk to you about, which is, as I've said previously, possibility of engaging with Exhibitionistas engaging with me. the biggest problem is the corporations, public, private, doesn't matter, that have replaced ⁓ every human interaction. ⁓ with a screen or with a platform or a software or any kind of device that you just have to tap but also my space, Worlding if you're not in London or even in UK, if anything, there's the possibility of watching the talks that we do. We ⁓ post them there online. There was a really fascinating one about to ⁓ get some an answer that is never useful. ⁓ Never. That's really what takes up time, what makes my life difficult, that affects my mental ⁓ the artifacts in museums, what to do with from the perspective of someone whose parents ⁓ come from those places where these artifacts were ⁓ looted. And you can sense from my tone that I'm not happy about it. I'm really not. bought in not very legitimate conditions, Another thing we will do very soon is going to open a bookshop that is going to work bit differently. You'll see, but I'll announce it when the time comes. ⁓ And we will also be developing online events. More on that later. We have time. We have time. Let's build this together. and in to build this together. I really, really need your feedback. I really need you to tell me if you would like to join, for example, a reading club where we discuss a specific book. And book that I am to be discussing is the one that I will cover in the next episode, Work of Art in the Era of Mechanical Reproduction Walter Benjamin, German theorist. It is ⁓ one of the few philosophy or critical thinking books that has really pervaded ⁓ and traversed lot of fields ⁓ of practice, ⁓ of creativity, but also of technology. I'm not sure that book is really understood. So to explain very quickly, it is the book where he develops the concept of aura. saying that work of art is material thing, it's an object, and as an object, it exists in a place here and now, my sense of things is that you know, reading, watching, exhibition going, listening, ⁓ dancing along as well, ⁓ the art that then is related by and expanded potentially, hopefully, if critical thinking and talent and And you only get to experience it fully as a work of art - so the art experience will ⁓ ⁓ front of ⁓ with ⁓ in its presence, because it has a sort of an ⁓ And that aura is not ⁓ when the object is photographed, filmed, described, et cetera. So. creative thinking is there, expanded. platicar, as I said in the beginning, remember this Mexican word that means the art of conversation and experiencing are two very different things. And from one to the other, what we lose regards to the art object is the aura. ⁓ this text is often quoted and I decided to work on it because I came across the third quote in a week in a text that I was reading ⁓ Benjamin denouncing the ⁓ loss of the aura of the art object and the art in general and the sort of decay of culture and the death of society and the death of art, which is not what he says. There's a part of the book of the text, it's a very small text. There's a part of it that considers that possibility. But this book is not a closed book. It's not a diagnosis. It's a sort of a tutorial. is a huge sacrifice of time, of dedication, ⁓ of your life on hold a little bit to invest in shows, in these programs, and these in this content. And even in spaces, real spaces, to have a real space, to maintain a real space, you know, the South London Gallery at the moment needs to gather two million pounds to continue existing. almost if we want to speak in digital terms. Apologies for that. Crude language, I know. Terrible. It's very difficult maintain culture. So ⁓ my feeling, what I perceived is that I have a role to play in it. So I have a role to play in commenting, in using the interactivity that is there to support this content. You know, that's the real important thing. So that's one of the things that I am thinking of doing, sort of a reading online and in the space at Worlding ⁓ as ⁓ one per month activity that we can do together. So let me know if you're interested, what you'd like to do, if you have other ideas, ⁓ artists out there. I was asked by one or two artists about artist mentorships, mentorships. I don't know if I see myself as a mentor, but I would love to have sessions where artists talk about their worries, their strategies, their projects. As a curator, that's what I do. And maybe that's also a possibility. So artists out there who listen to the podcast, let me know if this is something that might interest you. then ⁓ the digital hygiene is in the awareness of where your go, of where your ⁓ attention goes, ⁓ and your intention goes as well. I'm still building it The thing that is finished is the structure of the ⁓ so, finishing, wrapping up. ⁓ you so much for around. Thank you for your curiosity. Thank you for the art of wonderment that you're showing everything is accessible nowadays, and therefore the intentionality needs to be there. finally, Brainstorm in a Teacup, is an unrelated thought. I feel the need to do that to reassess ⁓ where my time goes, where my goes, and where my attention goes, and eventually ⁓ what I'm financing, why what I'm and whether I'm compensating the people who are giving me something, nourishing me at the end of each episode. the interactivity, that community that Keke Palmer was talking about. is really what drew me here to podcasting. And it's really important to create it actively. And that just means, you know, putting up in your stories an episode that you enjoyed, talking about this musician that you listen to in a small bar and you spotted their account somewhere on some platform where you know people other people can listen to their music, talking about them to your friends, putting it on your WhatsApp group chats. culture is the way. For us to build togetherness. real creatives ⁓ need digital media. to be known. So we are in this conundrum of creatives who are not celebrities, who do not have a huge following, need digital media to spread the word, to put their shows out there, to put their voice out there, to put their work out. at the end of each episode, finally, last thing, you have Brainstorm in a teacup, which is where I read an unrelated thought that I pluck out ⁓ of probably the notebooks of the week, but it can go back. have so many. it's going to be an honest thought that I find important enough to share, but too weird to turn into an episode, most likely. So there you go. ⁓ That's the structure of the episode. So you always have something to look forward to ⁓ if our eyeballs and our attention is on celebrity culture, that provides free content, very important and very interesting, then we are feeding the influencer type. Of culture, which is not to be completely berated. It's fine. It might have brought awareness to someone out there. I'm pretty sure that Katy Hassell has done a lot for visual art. great. But it's not the only kind of content out there. ⁓ it's a kind of content that you will consume because it's free. And then what happens is that you're creating a monolithic kind of visual arts culture, to speak only of visual arts, but it's the same in literature and elsewhere, In Portugal, a lot of the stories that I remember being told as a child started with once upon a time, when the animals still knew how to talk. No tempo ⁓ que os animais ainda falavam. Era uma vez. I'm not sure I followed the story as attentively as I delighted myself with the idea that animals had reached an enlightenment so perfect that they didn't need words anymore. When I chat with my cat panions, they're kind enough to utter a few words, ⁓ but the depth of our communication is That does not create the joy that Wordsworth was talking about and that Agnes Martin was talking about. This is not only about me, by the way. I'm not trying to create anything for exhibitionists as notes on art or for Art Thinkosaurus, my Substack page, or Worlding, my online shop. It's for everyone. telepathic. Thank you for sticking around. Have great one. ⁓ Be an exhibitionista. visit exhibitions. Let me live vicariously through you and tell me about them. Leave. some comments in there, write me an email and who knows, maybe I'll read some of your texts. They can become a brainstorm in a teacup. Maybe, maybe I can have guests in this little segment. Anyway, send me a voice message. Tell me about your experiences. Leave comments, follow, subscribe. Don't forget to donate. That would be really lovely And that's what I did for myself. It did affect the way I consume things. That's makes it possible to be here That's what sustains ⁓ this podcast So if you enjoy ⁓ if you're excited about what's gonna in a fortnight, is continuing with polished format a more streamlined experience for you, but still the same delirious ⁓ wonderment wandering There's magazines there, you know, Women Who Podcast magazine is one of them, where can find content, you can find ⁓ new podcasts to listen to. Do the deed. There's a link in the show's notes. On Substack, you can also support us. There's many ways for you to do it. You can go on our website. There's a donating page over there. So do support us. Leave comments. Contact me. Tell me what you want. Tell me what you need and I'll see what I can do about it. All right. Have a good one. Take care of yourself. Bye bye. See you in two weeks or no, you'll see me or you will hear me anyway, we'll be in each other's presence very soon. Bye bye. That's it for the digital hygiene segment and question. I hope you liked it. And I would love to hear your thoughts on this. ⁓ Take care.